Difference between pages "Arriving in Stavanger" and "The Mine"

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Continued from '''[[Back to Treborg]]'''.
+
Continued from '''[[Restarting on the 19th of July]]'''
__TOC__
 
  
'''The DM:''' Setting out at 9 a.m., you’re frustrated when an hour out of Treborg, the wind dies.  Completely.  You row for two hours, when the wind finally picks up at noon, in the wrong direction.  Nadia raises the sail and you begin to crawl your way south to Stavanger; by three you’ve made 8 knots, about a third of the journey.  The wind improves, spins around to the east and you make 2 knots an hour for the next six hours, putting you 4 knots from Stavanger.  The wind increases, swings to the southeast – directly in your face – and it begins to rainBailing, you tack the last four hours, arriving in Stavanger at 1 a.m. on the 10th of July.  It is pouring rain.  Nadia shrugs.  She got you here.  Malady checks come to naught.  Embla’s parents will put you up for the night if you ask.
+
== Starting Down ==
 +
'''The DM:''' The stairs at '''c.''' lead into a cold pool of air that for whatever reason baffles your infravisionYou will all need manual illumination of some kind in order to see.
  
== July 10th ==
+
'''Marcule:''' Sorry everyone i will be absent today, I had my shot yesterday and it has put me on my ass. I will see you on Friday.
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' Very kind of them, I beg their hospitality and thank them for it. I collapse exhausted into whatever sleeping accommodations they provide.
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I obtain and light a torch. About how far down do the stairs go before reaching the water?
 +
: '''The DM:''' sorry, miswrote. That should be "air" not water. I've changed it above.
  
'''[[Pandred]]''': "I hate boats."
+
'''The DM:''' As a reminder, the stairs are steep and drop about 25 feet overall.
 +
Lexent]]:''' That simplifies things. Might we presume Marcule will hold the torch for us while we continue?
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' Is there a particular gnomish deity of water, ships, or travel to whom I should be making appeals? (or cursing?) ;)
+
'''The DM:''' No, afraid not.  You'll have to do on your own.  Marcule is assisting the sappers in their search.  I always try to have absent characters participating in the safest activity at the moment of their departure.
  
'''Marcule:''' Also hate boats.
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' OK. I proceed with the torch carefully to the bottom of the stairs.
  
'''The DM:''' Nicer when they’re bigger.  Besides, it was the weather, not the boatWould you have rather slogged 24 miles in these conditions?  Anyway, in the morning, it is a moderate to heavy rain, with more than a quarter inch falling every hourThere is little wind and it is a “warm” rain, as the temperature is cool and nearly pleasant.
+
'''The DM:''' The temperature drops practically to freezing as you light on the bottom of the stairsYou can see your breath and there’s very little heat coming from the torchI’m working on a map.
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' If I calculate correctly, it is Sunday. Does that mean the market and shops will be closed? Is there a gnomish population of any note in Stavanger?
+
[[File:Mine 01.jpg|right|385px|thumb|]]
 +
'''The DM:''' sorry, got caught up working on the effect.
  
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' Many thanks to Nadia for the crossing and Embla's parents for a roof.
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' "Well, with this torch, we're targets for anything down here."
  
'''The DM:''' What's next?
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I start proceeding along the lefthand wall.
  
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' If it is indeed Sunday, will Embla's parents be attending services?
+
'''The DM:''' You move only five feet when you realize you're not alone in here.  A shadow flashes on the periphery of your right eye and your head snaps around to see there's nothing there.  Just like a horror flick.
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' If shopping is a viable option, I would like to head first to the Weaponwright. Otherwise, I am interested in getting to know the gnomish community in Stavanger (if any) and making sure that their spiritual needs are being met.
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' Are there any other distinguishing features within our sight?
  
'''The DM:''' There is shopping on Sundays. Embla's parents will be attending services.
+
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' In. I'll go join Lexent. (I intentionally did not check the bed; thought that would be too on the nose!)
 +
:'''[[Lexent]]:''' After that post I couldn't risk not checking. Believe me. I tried.
  
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' I will accompany them and meet the party at the market afterwards.
+
'''[[Pandred]]''': I'll set myself up just beside Lex on his left. Grit my teeth, rolling with the Battleaxe.
  
'''The DM:''' Sorry I can’t give you an updated price list, but please ask me about anything that seems suspicious.
+
'''The DM:''' If I had thought of something to put there, you would have found something in the bed.  Without updating the map, I’m counting Lexent in 2528 and Vafrandir in 2529.  Vafrandir, you notice that you can’t see anything that your body casts a shadow against.  The torch isn’t throwing any ambient light off the ceiling or walls that would give light.  Something in here is messing with simple physics.
  
'''The DM:''' Vafrandir make a wisdom check.
+
'''The DM:''' Until someone gives ground, counting Pandred on the stairs, where “2429” would be.
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I head to the Weaponwright. Once there I show him one of the pieces of adamantium and ask if he is able to work it for me. I am firstly interested in repairing my Godentag with some amount of the adamantium used for the spike.
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' While watching into the darkness, I edge another 5 feet along the wall.
  
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' I roll a '''19'''.
+
'''Pandred''': I'll follow behind. Arduin well in the rear.
  
'''The DM:''' You get nothing from the service, I'm afraid.  It occurs to me that a wisdom check could get you a +1% bonus on experience in your next encounter, or perhaps for the next 1,000 x.p. you earn (though that might be difficult to calculate).  Perhaps a flat +100 bonus if you're in an encounter from which you take damage.
+
Taking off Vafrandir's move for now; look carefully at the image.
: Stuff like that would encourage players to attend church.  Hm.  50 x.p. bonus per level.  With a 7-day deadline.
+
[[File:Mine 02.jpg|left|245px|]]
::'''[[Lexent]]:''' What would be the gnomish practice for regular spiritual fullfilment?
 
::: '''The DM:''' Was thinking about that.  The rules have to be different for clerics; something others can get that clerics can't, but in compensation there are things clerics can get that others don't.  Your attending a shrine for your god, for example, would be meaningful to you but not to them.  And it would matter where you put your sage abilities.
 
::::'''[[Lexent]]:''' I'm looking in the more general sense too, wanting to know what I can do FOR my community around me and how I can more meaningfully react to the world, not just benefits I can receive.
 
  
'''The DM:''' In any case, Lexent could reach out to the gnome community in Stavanger; there would be one, of several hundred.  This wouldn’t give you the enlightenment Vafrandir missed out on, because as a cleric it is all old hat to you, but it might give you prospects on places to visit to shed some scales from your eyes.
+
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' Nice, very creepy!
  
'''The DM:''' What you can do for your community comes out of your sage abilities.  As a physician, you could see while you’re here if there’s a call for your services in that regard.
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' Would setting the torch down in 2728 still provide us light with which we could fight if necessary?
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' If permissible, then, I would like to spend the time in which the Lutherans in our group might be attending services getting to know the gnomish people here and seeing how their spiritual needs are being met.
+
'''The DM:''' I think we’ll have Vafrandir roll initiative.
  
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' I'd very much use a rule like that even though I'm not benefiting from it today.
+
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' '''raw 4; adj 5'''.
  
== The Gnomes of Stavanger ==
+
== Something ==
'''The DM:''' I’ve nothing prepared Lexent, but I’ll draw out an outline, hopefully one not too clicheWriting off the top of my head. The gnome community here is a group of bookbinders and scribes, committed towards the collection of works on (rolled randomly) medicine, prospecting and music.   
+
'''The DM:''' Absolutely not, Lexent.  You’ve already noticed that the torch only gives off half the light you would normally expect; there’s NO reflection off the roof, and logically the floorPutting the torch down would black out everything outside a five foot circle.
 +
:'''[[Lexent]]:''' Understood.
  
: Narina is the head of a medical school, with knowledge in your own subject and with instructionHer school has 20 students.
+
'''The DM:''' Sorry, VafrandirI rolled a six.
  
: Part of the community are a group of miners who venture out at this time of year and return when the light dims in autumn; they are mostly gone, but there is one aged engineer named Glinner; he is drafting plans to rework and replumb a mine north of Sauda in Ioglefeld.
+
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' You win some, you lose some.
 +
[[File:Mine 03.jpg|right|350px|]]
  
: There is also a small musical college dedicated to gnomish music and poetry, run by Pumbar; there are some 25 attendants.
+
'''The DM:''' A literal black shadow rushes out of the blackness and attacks Vafrandir.  It rolls a 5 and misses.
  
: On these three subjects there are regular books being written and two printing presses in operation.
+
=== Party’s Round 1 ===
 +
If you attack, please say what you’re attacking with.  Pandred, if you move into 2629, you’ll block Lexent’s torch and you won’t be able to see a thing in front of you.
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' Excellent. Thank you. With the time I spend among them today do I learn of any of them that are in need of healing or medical care?
+
'''[[Lexent]]:''' Can a torch be used as a weapon, and if so, does that entail risking the light of the torch?
: '''The DM:''' If you’re up for it, you can relieve a nurse in her hospital and care for as many patients (aid rest) as you’re able.  But that will mean you’ll have no time to buy at a market today.
 
  
== Market ==
+
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' I'm close, so I'll attack with my longsword. '''12 raw, 15 to hit; 1 raw, 3 dmg'''.
'''The DM:''' Anyone here not have the Stavanger Market file?
 
  
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I have access to a copy of it [https://drive.google.com/file/d/1xOqVK3fSoQd8Phu_3dKYIExhNAtThSF6/view?usp=sharing here] . Once the time for services is past I turn my attention to shopping and proceed to the weaponwright.
+
'''Pandred''': I'll call out to Arduin to toss me the +1 Spear while I drop the Battleaxe. Let me know if I have AP remaining when I get it in hand. "Arduin, SPEAR, now!"
: '''The DM:''' you’re giving me conflicting actions, Lexent.
+
 
 +
'''The DM:''' There’s a rule for all such questions, Lexent. See the rules under [https://tao-dndwiki.blogspot.com/2018/02/using-found-objects-as-weapons.html Found Objects used as Weapons]. Check the torch’s weight.  Yes, every time you hit with it, you could extinguish the flame.
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' Hm.  Arduin reacts and tosses it; [https://wiki.alexissmolensk.com/index.php/Action_Points#Throw_aimed_object Throw aimed object] is two AP; that includes your catch.  Pandred needs 2 AP to throw it or otherwise attack with it.  I think I’ll ask for a wisdom check from Arduin to see if he hesitates.
 +
 
 +
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I move to 2728 and attempt to turn the Something (undead seems likely) ''To Turn:'' '''14'''
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' The creature is beyond you; it cannot be turned by someone with less than 10 points in dweomercraft.
 +
 
 +
'''Arduin''': '''6''' on the wisdom check. "Heads up, Pan!"
 +
 
 +
'''Pandred''': Can you rephrase that? Do you mean it costs him 2 AP to throw it, costs us both 2 AP to throw/catch it, or that it costs us 1 each, one for his throw and one for my catch?
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' Tempting to say it takes him 2 to throw it and you 1 to catch it, but time is passing ... I’ve got to argue you have to wait for it, so 2 AP for both of you.  I think I’ll skip you making a dexterity check.
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' Vafrandir, I should have actually looked at the Puissance table last week.  “Draw Speed” says plainly, “decreases the penalty incurred by firing a bow more quickly, while improving the time in which a crossbow can be loaded.”  My error.  So, the penalty for loading and firing a bow in one round is reduced to -3 to hit.  The crossbow speed for loading a light crossbow is reduced from two rounds loading and one round firing to 1 round loading; for a heavy crossbow, from three rounds loading to 2.  The adjustment to pulling a weapon from your scabbard is also included.
 +
: '''[[Vafrandir]]:''' Understood. Thanks!
 +
 
 +
'''Pandred''': Then I advance to 2629 with Spear in hand. That's me. "Hroagh!"
 +
 
 +
== Shadow’s Round 2 ==
 +
'''The DM:''' Putting up the map after the shadow’s move.  It attacks Pandred, rolling a 17; Pandred takes 3 damage AND loses 4 points of strength ... no saving throw.  The strength drain stuns Pandred from the shock; she stands and shivers, and does not fall back (moderately paralyzing in effect).  The shadow takes its place in 2729.
 +
 
 +
[[File:Mine 04.jpg|right|350px|]]
 +
Lexent’s new position lights up the whole cavern, so the shadow is revealed.  Lexent and Vafrandir can act.
 +
 
 +
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I also assume a torch cannot be effectively held in the same hand as a shield, correct?
 +
 
 +
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' Shit! I advance to 2630 and attack and with longsword: '''13 raw, 16 to hit; 7 raw, 9 dmg'''.
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' Pandred, is Arduin using a shield?  What weapon do you want me to put in his hand?
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' The longsword isn't magic and doesn't hit.  Oh definitely, Lexent.  No possible way to do that.
 +
 
 +
'''Arduin''': A sling I think, even if spears are cooler.
 +
:'''Pandred''': No shield currently. Unlucky getting hit so early. I assume that drops me to 14, and the percentile strength doesn't affect anything?
 +
'''The DM:''' In this case, your 18 percentage counts as 18.
 +
 
 +
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I attack with the torch. ''To Hit:'' '''12-3=9''' ''Damage:'' '''2'''
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' the torch isn't magical either. Both it and Vafrandir's sword just go straight through the shadow's body without contacting anything.
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' Okay, the sling depiction will have to wait.  working on next round.
 +
 
 +
== Shadow’s Round 3 ==
 +
'''The DM:''' Sensing that Pandred is the only one that can hurt it, the shadow attacks Pandred again, rolling a 12.  That hits AC 6, missing. 
 +
 
 +
[[File:Mine 05.jpg|right|420px|thumb|hope you like the look of him, Pandred]]
 +
 
 +
=== Player’s Round 3 ===
 +
Vafrandir and Lexent, you’ll have to think of something else.  Arduin has shillelagh as an option.  Pandred, you can roll for real now.
 +
 
 +
'''Pandred''': 9+1 hits '''AC 6''', 3+1 is '''4''' damage.
 +
 
 +
'''Arduin''' I begin to cast ''shillelagh''. Also I look good as hell.
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' shockingly, that hits Pandred.  It’s stunned.  Technically, since it takes one round to cast, Arduin doesn’t need to “begin” ... he just casts it.  He can discharge the spell next round.
 +
 
 +
: I want to see if Lexent or Vafrandir have an action.
 +
 
 +
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I cast ''cause light wounds''.
 +
 
 +
'''[[Vafrandir]]:''' I'll move to 2830. I don't have any magic, but I can flank for Pandred.
 +
 
 +
'''Pandred''': Oh snap! I have a spear! That's so rad!
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' I do my best.  Because the shadow missed, let's have:
 +
 
 +
=== Player's Round 4 ===
 +
'''The DM:''' Take another move.
 +
 
 +
'''[[Lexent]]:''' I attack the darkness. ''To Hit:'' '''2'''.
 +
:'''[[Lexent]]:''' Sorry, couldn't resist the phrasing.
 +
:: '''The DM:''' I absolutely would have done that also.  You know, before I went to Toronto with my book in '14, I staged that youtube video to get funding.
 +
 
 +
'''Pandred''': THE SPEAR OF GOD DESCENDS!! '''20''' +1 to hit is a '''CRIT'''! No triple, but don't worry kids because damage is 6+1, doubled to '''14'''! "HROAGH!"
 +
 
 +
'''The DM:''' Um, that's one discorporated shadow.
 +
 
 +
'''Pandred''': "HROAGH!"
 +
 
 +
'''Arduin''': "...Right, well done. Weren't some of the goblin-swords semi-magical? Do I recall that incorrectly?"

Revision as of 13:07, 19 May 2021

Continued from Restarting on the 19th of July

Starting Down

The DM: The stairs at c. lead into a cold pool of air that for whatever reason baffles your infravision. You will all need manual illumination of some kind in order to see.

Marcule: Sorry everyone i will be absent today, I had my shot yesterday and it has put me on my ass. I will see you on Friday.

Lexent: I obtain and light a torch. About how far down do the stairs go before reaching the water?

The DM: sorry, miswrote. That should be "air" not water. I've changed it above.

The DM: As a reminder, the stairs are steep and drop about 25 feet overall. Lexent]]: That simplifies things. Might we presume Marcule will hold the torch for us while we continue?

The DM: No, afraid not. You'll have to do on your own. Marcule is assisting the sappers in their search. I always try to have absent characters participating in the safest activity at the moment of their departure.

Lexent: OK. I proceed with the torch carefully to the bottom of the stairs.

The DM: The temperature drops practically to freezing as you light on the bottom of the stairs. You can see your breath and there’s very little heat coming from the torch. I’m working on a map.

Mine 01.jpg

The DM: sorry, got caught up working on the effect.

Lexent: "Well, with this torch, we're targets for anything down here."

Lexent: I start proceeding along the lefthand wall.

The DM: You move only five feet when you realize you're not alone in here. A shadow flashes on the periphery of your right eye and your head snaps around to see there's nothing there. Just like a horror flick.

Lexent: Are there any other distinguishing features within our sight?

Vafrandir: In. I'll go join Lexent. (I intentionally did not check the bed; thought that would be too on the nose!)

Lexent: After that post I couldn't risk not checking. Believe me. I tried.

Pandred: I'll set myself up just beside Lex on his left. Grit my teeth, rolling with the Battleaxe.

The DM: If I had thought of something to put there, you would have found something in the bed. Without updating the map, I’m counting Lexent in 2528 and Vafrandir in 2529. Vafrandir, you notice that you can’t see anything that your body casts a shadow against. The torch isn’t throwing any ambient light off the ceiling or walls that would give light. Something in here is messing with simple physics.

The DM: Until someone gives ground, counting Pandred on the stairs, where “2429” would be.

Lexent: While watching into the darkness, I edge another 5 feet along the wall.

Pandred: I'll follow behind. Arduin well in the rear.

Taking off Vafrandir's move for now; look carefully at the image.

Mine 02.jpg

Vafrandir: Nice, very creepy!

Lexent: Would setting the torch down in 2728 still provide us light with which we could fight if necessary?

The DM: I think we’ll have Vafrandir roll initiative.

Vafrandir: raw 4; adj 5.

Something

The DM: Absolutely not, Lexent. You’ve already noticed that the torch only gives off half the light you would normally expect; there’s NO reflection off the roof, and logically the floor. Putting the torch down would black out everything outside a five foot circle.

Lexent: Understood.

The DM: Sorry, Vafrandir. I rolled a six.

Vafrandir: You win some, you lose some.

Mine 03.jpg

The DM: A literal black shadow rushes out of the blackness and attacks Vafrandir. It rolls a 5 and misses.

Party’s Round 1

If you attack, please say what you’re attacking with. Pandred, if you move into 2629, you’ll block Lexent’s torch and you won’t be able to see a thing in front of you.

Lexent: Can a torch be used as a weapon, and if so, does that entail risking the light of the torch?

Vafrandir: I'm close, so I'll attack with my longsword. 12 raw, 15 to hit; 1 raw, 3 dmg.

Pandred: I'll call out to Arduin to toss me the +1 Spear while I drop the Battleaxe. Let me know if I have AP remaining when I get it in hand. "Arduin, SPEAR, now!"

The DM: There’s a rule for all such questions, Lexent. See the rules under Found Objects used as Weapons. Check the torch’s weight. Yes, every time you hit with it, you could extinguish the flame.

The DM: Hm. Arduin reacts and tosses it; Throw aimed object is two AP; that includes your catch. Pandred needs 2 AP to throw it or otherwise attack with it. I think I’ll ask for a wisdom check from Arduin to see if he hesitates.

Lexent: I move to 2728 and attempt to turn the Something (undead seems likely) To Turn: 14

The DM: The creature is beyond you; it cannot be turned by someone with less than 10 points in dweomercraft.

Arduin: 6 on the wisdom check. "Heads up, Pan!"

Pandred: Can you rephrase that? Do you mean it costs him 2 AP to throw it, costs us both 2 AP to throw/catch it, or that it costs us 1 each, one for his throw and one for my catch?

The DM: Tempting to say it takes him 2 to throw it and you 1 to catch it, but time is passing ... I’ve got to argue you have to wait for it, so 2 AP for both of you. I think I’ll skip you making a dexterity check.

The DM: Vafrandir, I should have actually looked at the Puissance table last week. “Draw Speed” says plainly, “decreases the penalty incurred by firing a bow more quickly, while improving the time in which a crossbow can be loaded.” My error. So, the penalty for loading and firing a bow in one round is reduced to -3 to hit. The crossbow speed for loading a light crossbow is reduced from two rounds loading and one round firing to 1 round loading; for a heavy crossbow, from three rounds loading to 2. The adjustment to pulling a weapon from your scabbard is also included.

Vafrandir: Understood. Thanks!

Pandred: Then I advance to 2629 with Spear in hand. That's me. "Hroagh!"

Shadow’s Round 2

The DM: Putting up the map after the shadow’s move. It attacks Pandred, rolling a 17; Pandred takes 3 damage AND loses 4 points of strength ... no saving throw. The strength drain stuns Pandred from the shock; she stands and shivers, and does not fall back (moderately paralyzing in effect). The shadow takes its place in 2729.

Mine 04.jpg

Lexent’s new position lights up the whole cavern, so the shadow is revealed. Lexent and Vafrandir can act.

Lexent: I also assume a torch cannot be effectively held in the same hand as a shield, correct?

Vafrandir: Shit! I advance to 2630 and attack and with longsword: 13 raw, 16 to hit; 7 raw, 9 dmg.

The DM: Pandred, is Arduin using a shield? What weapon do you want me to put in his hand?

The DM: The longsword isn't magic and doesn't hit. Oh definitely, Lexent. No possible way to do that.

Arduin: A sling I think, even if spears are cooler.

Pandred: No shield currently. Unlucky getting hit so early. I assume that drops me to 14, and the percentile strength doesn't affect anything?

The DM: In this case, your 18 percentage counts as 18.

Lexent: I attack with the torch. To Hit: 12-3=9 Damage: 2

The DM: the torch isn't magical either. Both it and Vafrandir's sword just go straight through the shadow's body without contacting anything.

The DM: Okay, the sling depiction will have to wait. working on next round.

Shadow’s Round 3

The DM: Sensing that Pandred is the only one that can hurt it, the shadow attacks Pandred again, rolling a 12. That hits AC 6, missing.

hope you like the look of him, Pandred

Player’s Round 3

Vafrandir and Lexent, you’ll have to think of something else. Arduin has shillelagh as an option. Pandred, you can roll for real now.

Pandred: 9+1 hits AC 6, 3+1 is 4 damage.

Arduin I begin to cast shillelagh. Also I look good as hell.

The DM: shockingly, that hits Pandred. It’s stunned. Technically, since it takes one round to cast, Arduin doesn’t need to “begin” ... he just casts it. He can discharge the spell next round.

I want to see if Lexent or Vafrandir have an action.

Lexent: I cast cause light wounds.

Vafrandir: I'll move to 2830. I don't have any magic, but I can flank for Pandred.

Pandred: Oh snap! I have a spear! That's so rad!

The DM: I do my best. Because the shadow missed, let's have:

Player's Round 4

The DM: Take another move.

Lexent: I attack the darkness. To Hit: 2.

Lexent: Sorry, couldn't resist the phrasing.
The DM: I absolutely would have done that also. You know, before I went to Toronto with my book in '14, I staged that youtube video to get funding.

Pandred: THE SPEAR OF GOD DESCENDS!! 20 +1 to hit is a CRIT! No triple, but don't worry kids because damage is 6+1, doubled to 14! "HROAGH!"

The DM: Um, that's one discorporated shadow.

Pandred: "HROAGH!"

Arduin: "...Right, well done. Weren't some of the goblin-swords semi-magical? Do I recall that incorrectly?"